Disciplining others kids

[natrfrk]

Okay, so I have a question about discipline. When it's your own kids, you just sort of know what to do , usually... but when you're in charge of other's sometimes it's hard to know what will be effective. So I'm wondering about role reversal, to show the kids in the wrong how it feels to be treated that way. I'm not talking about allowing cruelty or hitting. Just for example, if one kid is constantly being left out and not allowed to play with the others, well, letting that kid play and be in control, and allowing that kid to exclude the one who is usually in control. All the while reminding them all that this is just a role play and not how we should treat each other on a regular basis but that it's to show everyone how it feels to be treated that way. Is that stupid? Or do you think it might be an effective way to teach the bully kid(s) that what they are doing isn't fun?

[Nikki Dawn]

Well it all depends on the kid. I know all of mine respond differently. Age matters too. My dd 9 had a run in with her best friend this summer. Turns out she was not a friend at all. Long story short it was a great way for me to explain her actions with others for when the time came. I also let her watch the American Girl Movie Chrissa on bullying. I thought it was an appropriate time. I also lecture my own from time to time on not leaving others out. Sometimes it is good to include all kids whether they are involved or not so noone is singled out. Then let them give input. Now if they are small kids it is tougher.

[cbuffy]

I like role reversal and used it often with my 4 boys. Kids are ego-centric and don't often even THINK to think about others. It's just how they are. So they sometimes need to have an experience that forces them to feel what others are feeling. (but like you said, not hitting or cruelty...) There's nothing wrong with putting the bully on the couch and doing something fun with everybody else and THEN inviting the bully to join you. A quick - wow, I'm so sorry you couldn't join us sooner - it was AWFUL sitting up there by yourself, wasn't it! Bet Johnny was pretty sad when you wouldn't let him play with you... can sometimes bring the point home.

[natrfrk]

Well these kids are 6, 8, and 10. And the middle one seems to be the "bully". But then mine (the 10 yr old), will follow her lead!!! And it gets me so upset that my child being older would follow a bad behavior especially when it's coming from a younger child. I expect her to set an example. So I finally had enough and I told the youngest that she could be in charge. She could be my helper and get to act like she was 10 and see what it was like to be the older girls, and I told the older girls that they were going to be treated like the 6 year old. And if she wanted to exclude one from play and say they were too young than so be it. Now, I informed their mother I was going to do this, and she didn't have a problem with it. She dropped them off in the morning and the 8 year old thought it was all fun and games until she started getting excluded. Then it wasn't fun anymore. So then I had her write a report for me on what she had learned and told her that if she learned the right lesson, I would put things back to normal if she promised to treat her sister with respect. So that all turned out good, until about half an hour later, she already forgot what she had learned! So we finished the day with reversed roles. I think it worked. But then they came back today and said their dad is really mad at me and if I ever do that again they can never come back! So I was just wondering if it was really that bad of a thing to do. There's only so much I can do to discipline kids that are not mine, ya know? Mine got grounded for partaking in the misbehavior. And she also had to do the role reversal. She learned from it and she is being good to the little one today. Actually, they both are, because despite what their dad said, I told them that they have no warnings today, first offense puts us back in role reversal mode. They are angels today. So it worked. I don't understand why he's mad.

[hjajck]

Did you speak to their father? Kids say a lot of things that aren't actually true. ;)

[pamelaw]

Did you speak to their father? Kids say a lot of things that aren't actually true. ;)

Sounds like a snit fit and they're blaming dad for their being mad at you.

I wish I had the authority to do this with the adult bullies I know; so far their kids are okay, but they're only years away from hormone-ville and they'll imitate their mothers. Yack.

[BlessedMama]

I'd have a talk with the dad, too. After all, he didn't come to YOU and say anything!

What a tough situation! And quite frankly, if the parents aren't behind you, you don't want that influence, anyway. I don't think you did anything wrong. They can find out at 8 that being a bully is no fun, or they can find out in much bigger ways when they are 18 or 28 or...

My parents raised my brother and me differently. I'm the oldest and there are 11 years between us. They were super strict with me, but lovingly so (for the most part). My brother comes along, and my mom feels "sorry" for him and started undermining my dad. My dad wasn't perfect, but it obviously set him and my brother at odds. Mom wouldn't discipline him for things. Bought him things as a kid and then vehicles as a teen. He got into trouble 2 or 3 times as a minor, and then did something stupid--twice--as an 18 yo. Then he got his "spanking"--1 1/2 years in prison, not able to see his little son for 6 months and he didn't get to hold him again until a year later. I told my dds that people think discipline of sorts is bad for children--I say it's child abuse to not be a parent and teach them lovingly that there are consequences to their actions and let the police and prisons teach it later!

Perhaps you can talk with the parents and say, "What do you propose I do? What would you want done if it were MY child bullying yours at your house?"

If they tell you kids will grow out of it, it might be just as well they don't come over. I never had those kinds of issues, although I had to get after one neighbor girl for pretending illegal things. I told her if we didn't want to really do those things, we don't do them for pretend (robbing and killing!). Another teen girl used to spend a lot of time over here, and she started getting wilder and wilder and would wear whatever around my dc. I don't expect everyone to look like me, but you can cover up around my little kids. I finally told her I expected her tummy and shoulders to be covered. She did comply--I think she really was wanting someone to set some boundaries, because her mom just let her go and didn't. She made some stupid choices, but thankfully she has come around and is married and a great mom to her two dc. I wouldn't have thought my influence counted for much 5 years ago, but you never know.

So although you are the "meanie", you may have an impact on that child far more than you could ever imagine! IF you can get the parents out of the way! :p

HUGS to you! Will pray for you to have wisdom!

[natrfrk]

Thanks everyone. Trisch, I know what you mean.

Well, I've had these kids since the 6 year old was 2 months old. And I've only met the dad a handful of times. And in the last year, they've divorced, I haven't seen him in almost 2 years and I haven't talked to him either. He's never been very involved. He only likes to get involved by way of going off through his kids. I talked to the mom about it and she didn't know anything about him being upset about that, but she said she is not upset about the discipline at all because she also has to deal with that behavior at home and she knows we have to try something! I told her it worked too and that despite his supposed threat I still told them they'd get no warning and at the first sign of bullying or fighting, we were going to have role reversal and they didn't have any problems all day. Not with the little one anyway.

The 8 year old did decide to get on my dd's nerves since she couldn't mess with her sister. But my dd held her own and when the 8 year old did things that she felt disrespected her, she got up and walked away. She didn't sit and take it like usual. I'm having her read a book called The Walk the Walk Book, It's a God Thing. And it's helping her to see some of what I've been trying to teach her. After the first chapter, she said to me, "mom, I think you wrote this book and you just didn't tell us it's you", I asked her why and she said "because it's all about what's been going on this summer!" So hopefully she will learn something from that book.

[ayj67]

natrfrk, I think you are just wondering and caring.

Let the girls know that if they have any disagreement with anyone, they should go straight to talk to the person therefore, you will like the father to call you between such and such hour from today to Sunday. If there is no calls, don't worry about it, it would either be the girl making it up for the father does have the guts to say his peace.

It is an additional lesson for the girl to not make things up or resolve issue by talking to the parties involved.

[BlessedMama]

Sounds like a good book, natrfrk! And that's great that your dd sees the value of it and is handling that situation better. Because as Pamela said, unfortunately we all will run into ADULTS that weren't taught boundaries, and we're going to have to set them. I have a sil I just don't go out of my way to call or chat with because she gets manipulative and trying to guilt me into doing everything her way. Or at least saying her way of anything is the best. I feel badly for the way she was treated as a kid, but she's 42 now and she can get.over.it. like everyone else does--dealing with your issues, getting out of yourself, and not letting other people browbeat you into guilt manipulation! :)

I'm gracious to her when we get together or need to call for some reason, but she went from calling me 2 hours at a time several times a week...to....um...not sure when the last time I actually talked to her on the phone was! Last winter, maybe?!

So anyway, glad you're teaching your girls early how to deal with these kinds of people. I finally figured out that I really wasn't doing them any favors, either, by catering to or pussy-footing around their issues! I don't usually confront someone on it, unless it's really necessary (and I have an issue with a df that is coming to that :p ), but I remind myself that if I must graciously point some things out, I am not responsible for whether they see it or not, like me or not, agree with me or not. My motivation is love and wanting the best for them, and if their present form of controlling everyone is not going to be best, and I'm close enough to them, I'll pray about saying something.

Sometimes it may be the spark that later brings them to grow up or let go of things. That is what happened to my neighbor girl. I finally saw she just wanted to suck up my time, and I had my own dc, she wasn't really wanting to be a part of our family, just come and go and make us feel sorry for her. I got tough with her, wouldn't watch her ds so she could have some "me" time (I'm not against that, but I saw quickly that she was using us), and she didn't come around for a long while. Later she told me, "If I had listened to half of what you were trying to tell me, I wouldn't be in some of the messes I'm in now." Ya think?!

It is rewarding to see her be such a caring mom now! No, I don't agree with feeding the kids massive sugar , but in everything else she is a really good mom, and even in the food, she is seeing that they eat out too much, etc. Now my role is to pray for her and I actually enjoy talking to her now. She is mindful of my time vs. just yakking to be yakking like she used to be. She understands now! ;)

Sounds like you have a good input into these kids' lives, and if you have the mom's blessing, and the dad isn't even that much involved, then even if he is saying it, I wouldn't worry about it! :)

HUGS to you!